Forum:Warrant officers
So, I've been perusing the rank pages yet again, making more improvements, and I've realized something: the warrant officer ranks are completely unnecessary. 99% of the ranks to the WO page are from the rank set pages. The remaining 1% are the USS Pendragon page and the USS Justice page. The Pendragon page shouldn't even have WO listed, since the character's page even says he's a SCPO. That just leaves the Justice page. I'd like to start deleting the WO ranks, because the insignia in question are actually for something else. Anyone else have a problem with me deleting them? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 02:03, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :Not me.--Logan MacLeod 05:02, 16 December 2006 (UTC) ::Me neither...Caar was originally designated a warrant officer, but that changed when the stories were actually written, I guess that list must have been copied from an earlier note file. I'll fix it. ::Just curious, what are the insignia actually supposed to be? --TimPendragon 16:56, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :::Well, at least for the 2366 sets, the one hollow pip was CPO and above (until 2369). The other ones have never been seen on screen. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 17:30, 16 December 2006 (UTC) ::::I meant what were the supposed insignia that you deleted supposed to represent? And didn't O'Brien start wearing the gray CPO insignia sometime in season three (2371)? I know it was introduced before the uniform change in "Rapture", but he wore the hollow pip into 2370, at least. --TimPendragon 19:48, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :::::They were supposed to represent different grades of warrant officers. The dating of the rank change isn't as important, because if you look at the pages, it's a small note. Someone should start perusing through some screen caps to get a definite date on O'Brien's rank change, because I know he wore the specialized insignia pre-FC uniform. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 19:51, 16 December 2006 (UTC) ::::::I'm checking around, someone on TrekBBS will know. By the way, did we ever see an actual warrant officer in Trek? I can't remember one, so those insignias could certainly be valid - between enlisted and commissioned. --TimPendragon 20:04, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :::::::Okay, O'Brien's new insignia first appeared in "Hippocratic Oath". --TimPendragon 20:25, 16 December 2006 (UTC) ::::::::Meaning the notes I have on the pages are correct. HO takes place in 2372 and the notes say 2372. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 20:29, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :::::::::Yup.--TimPendragon 20:30, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :: I was wondering about this -- i was planning to set up some tables to try and figure out equivalence in WO ranks -- i made a large number of drawings of fan fiction CPOs from the 2250s that use an insignia very similar to your CWO-2. ::BTW, O'Brien's later insignia didn't appear til after Hippocratic Oath -- "HO" was the first time he was referred to as a "senior chief" -- and he was wearing the "hollow pip" -- the same one he wore in TNG Season 6 when he was just a "chief" (before the promotion he mentioned receiving in DS9 season 1). So basically, he wore the same insignia for two ranks, and then got a new insignia later on. ::I designed the CPO insignia i created to look like a LTJG pin from a distance, possibly explaining why he was referred to as a CPO when he wore LTJG insignia in TNG seasons 2-5. -- Captain M.K.B. 23:33, 16 December 2006 (UTC) :::Relating this back to the topic, my fictitious rank scheme had WOs and CWOs wearing the "one black stripe" provisional insignia from Voyager, as well as variants with 1,2,3 or 4 thinner black stipes. I might've tried a couple with gold or black black chevrons imposed on a shortened Voyager provisional insignia type piece. :::If I have time maybe i'll look them up off my artwork directory. -- Captain M.K.B. 01:37, 17 December 2006 (UTC) Regarding the insignia, Mike, you're mistaken. It did appear in "Hippocratic Oath". Here's a screencap from Trekcore.com that proves it: http://ds9.trekcore.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=108&pos=45 --TimPendragon 03:05, 18 December 2006 (UTC) Now, I just have to ask -- not that I mind -- but why bother deleting the WO insignia? We never saw a warrant officer in TNG/DS9 and for all intents and purposes they are neither enlisted nor commissioned, so they could have had insignia other than the single hollow pip. I kinda liked, 'em, in fact. I don't mind them gone, but I wouldn't have minded them staying, either. --TimPendragon 03:05, 18 December 2006 (UTC) :also note that we've comeletely left out Kosinski's square insignia. Its something to think about if we're going to be updating warrant officer information again, the possibility that he was a WO. -- Captain M.K.B. 03:07, 18 December 2006 (UTC) :It's a distinct possibility that Kosinski was a provisional LTJG. Notice the 1 light and 1 dark square. Seem familiar? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 03:08, 18 December 2006 (UTC) ::also i was wrong but also right about O'Brien -- "HO" wasn't the first appearance of the SCPO patch -- O'Brien also wore it in "The Visitor" -- although i confused the order of the episodes. -- Captain M.K.B. 03:12, 18 December 2006 (UTC)